Surely you could have acknowledged that I was completely right?

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pariah
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Re: Surely you could have acknowledged that I was completely right?

Post by pariah » Sun Nov 05, 2017 9:25 pm

eugene wrote:
Sun Nov 05, 2017 9:17 pm
There have always been player/admin battles in ZCU/ZC. The difference being in the 90s the battles were over how to best run cricket
:lol: Neil Johnson and Murray Goodwin left! Are we all going to continue believing that the former left because he was aloof, and the latter left because he didn't wear the pants at home? :roll:

Kriterion_BD
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Re: Surely you could have acknowledged that I was completely right?

Post by Kriterion_BD » Sun Nov 05, 2017 10:07 pm

pariah wrote:
Sun Nov 05, 2017 9:22 pm
Kriterion_BD wrote:
Sun Nov 05, 2017 8:54 pm
..the indefensible theft by indigenous ZIM admins of ZC.
None of you and all journos globally have ever proved this.

Facts dont need proving. At any rate, its a tragically moot point since ZIM wont be playing Tests come 2019.
Truth is on the side of the oppressed; its against the oppressor. Time is on the side of the oppressed; its against the oppressor. You don't need anything else.
[Malcolm X]

ZIMDOGGY
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Re: Surely you could have acknowledged that I was completely right?

Post by ZIMDOGGY » Mon Nov 06, 2017 4:49 am

Kriterion_BD wrote:
Sun Nov 05, 2017 8:44 am
I am asking for enough honesty for the conservative to not pretend that they give a shit about a woman who is not their immediate relative.
The last video I saw of a poor girl being stoned, literally shook me for days. I try to campaign against this sort of thing, but its very hard when people closer and in better position to influence the culture come back with 'but, but.... this and that' rather than get on board completely. If they were, enough reform would have happened to have ended this by now.
Kriterion_BD wrote:
Sun Nov 05, 2017 8:44 am
I understand they wouldn't kill a girl...great, but why expect a medal just for that?
In my case, I never asked for a medal or a pat on the back. I was saying that apologists, referencing Pariah, but also drawing an analogy to parts of the arab world, make excuses and prohibit those from within trying their best to enact change. In ZCF terms, Pariah justifying what he does has probably hurt the efforts of someone like Gargamel on the ground. Continuing the Islamic theme, constant criticism of calling someone like Sheikh Tawhidi 'the fake Sheikh' and sending him death threats, just for opposing Sharia and violence, is not helping and doing damage.
Kriterion_BD wrote:
Sun Nov 05, 2017 8:44 am
How do people know its fake concern for women? Why prevent women from accessing reproductive healthcare? Oral contraceptives have many medical indications from polycystic ovarian syndrome to dysmenorrhea (google it) and many other conditions. Its not just about murdering fetuses.
I'm with you there! That's a fairly conservative stance common with the main religions, right wing republicans, etc. Its the lefties that show their hypocrisy here. I think the 'Right' side of the fence probably feels this is a very low battle and they should focus their energies elsewhere. Just my POV. Although I have seen Milo talk about this alot recently.
Kriterion_BD wrote:
Sun Nov 05, 2017 8:44 am
Just this week I watched Sean Hannity talk about countries where gays were being thrown off buildings. Thats a fine point if you believe gays have the right to marry and if transgender people can use whichever bathroom they choose, and if you think the military shouldn't spend 1 million dollars on gender reassignment surgery but its OK to spend on 40 million for viagra for straight men.
Why?
I personally dont want gays to be able to marry, and that Tranny nonsense is ridiculous. I dont however want to see them tortured and killed. Just be called out for what they are, sick individuals with Gender dysmporphia, that need mental help (Post op trannies actually have a higher suicide rate, the operation and playing into their fantasy doesnt help!). Like I said, dont want them killed, human life is sacred and people should be united in that.

Kriterion_BD wrote:
Sun Nov 05, 2017 8:44 am
Please do not demonize them for "not standing up" when muslims like the Peshmerga are on the front lines battling jihadists.
This is the thing that I think is lost on alot of people and alot of apologists, whether intentionally or unintentionally, tend to look over.
The Peshmerga are Kurds who are being brutalised in the region. Them fighting the ISIS filth, is more self preservation than the struggle against tyranny and evil. Dont get me wrong, good on them! I have much more respect forthem than the thousands of refugees who cowardly flee and not fight for their countries. You'll often find that the most vocal anti ISIS Muslims are Shi'ites, who the Sunni ISIS really consider heathens and human waste. I see much less vocal Sunnis against ISIS (I Know there are alot) and on the flipside, I very rarely see Shi'ites speak out against Hezbollah and such.

Make no mistake, I would LOVE to see Muslims stop killing themselves and others. The muslim world does this disproportianately to the rest. However the voices and actions must come from within, leftie apologists have to stop cuddling up to those who dont.
And, this thread is wayyyy of track!
Cricinfo profile of the 'James Bond' of cricket:

FULL NAME: Angus James Mackay
BORN: 13 June 1967, Harare
KNOWN AS: Gus Mackay

'The' Gus Mackay.

Hero.
Sportsman.
Artist.
Player.

**
Q. VUSI SIBANDA, WHERE DO YOU HOP?

A. UNDA DA ENTERTAINMENT CENTRE*

Kriterion_BD
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Re: Surely you could have acknowledged that I was completely right?

Post by Kriterion_BD » Mon Nov 06, 2017 6:41 am

The last video I saw of a poor girl being stoned, literally shook me for days. I try to campaign against this sort of thing, but its very hard when people closer and in better position to influence the culture come back with 'but, but.... this and that' rather than get on board completely. If they were, enough reform would have happened to have ended this by now.
Thats why I dont watch snuff videos. Same reason i dont watch gay porn.

You say you want us on board completely, but its not the same ship. You will hop right on because you are white, but I would need to be extreme vetted, and once allowed on the boat would have sail under a Confederate flag while being insulted for my faith.

Capt Humayun Khan gave his life for the US army only to have the Right insult his sacrifice simply because he was a Muslim.

If the Right has good intentions, they are very good at hiding them.
In my case, I never asked for a medal or a pat on the back. I was saying that apologists, referencing Pariah, but also drawing an analogy to parts of the arab world, make excuses and prohibit those from within trying their best to enact change. In ZCF terms, Pariah justifying what he does has probably hurt the efforts of someone like Gargamel on the ground. Continuing the Islamic theme, constant criticism of calling someone like Sheikh Tawhidi 'the fake Sheikh' and sending him death threats, just for opposing Sharia and violence, is not helping and doing damage.
I don't know who Sheikh tawhidi is, but there are plenty of people like him. My basic stance is, is the guy genuine? In other words someone who genuinle wants change in the Muslim world isn't also going to slam all 1.5 billion of them in blanket terms. Based on that litmus test, Majed Nawaz is a genuine reformer I feel, whereas Ayan Hirsi Ali is a nefarious opportunist. Although Ali doesnt claim to be Muslim.
I'm with you there! That's a fairly conservative stance common with the main religions, right wing republicans, etc. Its the lefties that show their hypocrisy here. I think the 'Right' side of the fence probably feels this is a very low battle and they should focus their energies elsewhere. Just my POV. Although I have seen Milo talk about this alot recently.
It would appear liberals are hypocritical and Bill Maher agrees with you. Why does the Left paradoxically support Muslims?

But I dont believe they are for the following reasons. The left does not support radical Muslims. No one on the left likes ISIS. At the same time, the Right believes all muslims are ISIS and any differences that might exist are negligible. The left is also merely taking the opposite position of the Right vis a vis Islam. That is actually expected and has always been the case.

The other thing is that the majority of Muslims are non-white so prejudice against them is often equated with racism, which the left opposes as a matter of principle. There is also a high degree of correlation between islamophobia and racism, perhaps around 90% (just a ballpark estimate here).

This is the thing that I think is lost on alot of people and alot of apologists, whether intentionally or unintentionally, tend to look over.

The Peshmerga are Kurds who are being brutalised in the region. Them fighting the ISIS filth, is more self preservation than the struggle against tyranny and evil. Dont get me wrong, good on them! I have much more respect forthem than the thousands of refugees who cowardly flee and not fight for their countries. You'll often find that the most vocal anti ISIS Muslims are Shi'ites, who the Sunni ISIS really consider heathens and human waste. I see much less vocal Sunnis against ISIS (I Know there are alot) and on the flipside, I very rarely see Shi'ites speak out against Hezbollah and such.

Make no mistake, I would LOVE to see Muslims stop killing themselves and others. The muslim world does this disproportianately to the rest. However the voices and actions must come from within, leftie apologists have to stop cuddling up to those who dont.
The refugees are no more or less cowardly than any English speaking person's ancestors who fled Europe for the US or Australia and elsewhere. The Puritans landed in the US to escape religious persecution from the Brits. How much do damage do you think a 40 yo woman with 5 kids would do to ISIS anways?

The Peshmerga are Kurds, but who are the Kurds? Most of them are devout Muslims who idolize Saladin. I know because my best friends in college were Iraqi Kurds. They fully supported Bush's war in 2003 but also never missed a single one of their 5 daily prayers or a single day of fasting. Attempting to de-muslimify them is quite offensive I feel.

Thats like saying Tatenda Taibu is not a Christian, he's a black Zimbabwean.

The Muslim world does not necessairly kill people disproportionately to the rest. It gets reported disproportionately because Muslims tend to be located in all the geopolitical hotspots. If you did body counts, you'd probably find that Christians killed more people in 2017 than any other religion because there are 2 billion of them in the world. Just in Africa alone, Christians are involved in 80% of conflicts on the continent from South Sudan to Uganda.

It would be preposterous to say the Christian world is at fault or all Christians are to be blamed.

A bunch of Jewish settlers just threw rocks at Palestinian farm hands. Its not reported so we dont hear about unless you saw the article on the Jerusalem post.

Every month in India the BJP targets Christians and Muslims or fails to prosecute those who do. But its rarely reported even by the BBC.

In the past 2 months, 600,000 Rohingya have fled across to Bangladesh due to ethnic cleansing by Buddhists in Myanmar. It has been reported so sparingly you may never have even heard of the Rohingya.

There is currently a war raging between Christians and Muslims in the Central African Republic. Again not reported.

At the end the end of the day, progressives want to create a society that is accepting of all people evennif their values are different . The Right and ISIS only want people to adopt their value system.
Truth is on the side of the oppressed; its against the oppressor. Time is on the side of the oppressed; its against the oppressor. You don't need anything else.
[Malcolm X]

Conant
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Re: Surely you could have acknowledged that I was completely right?

Post by Conant » Tue Nov 07, 2017 3:22 pm

pariah wrote:
Sun Nov 05, 2017 9:22 pm
Kriterion_BD wrote:
Sun Nov 05, 2017 8:54 pm
..the indefensible theft by indigenous ZIM admins of ZC.
None of you and all journos globally have ever proved this.

My version remains fact, and yours fiction.

I had interesting discussions on this in Conant's article a 4 years ago
http://www.theroar.com.au/2013/09/29/wh ... /#comments

Where is betterdays?
Wonderful article and very interesting Conant! But of course Peter Ndlovu is better than George Shaya lol! None of our cricket teams(Flower era included) have ever had the kind of overall talent Zimbabwe’s national football teams have had – particularly the two generations stretching from 1990-2006. After all, it’s not that hard to look good, or come close to achieving something as a nation in a sport that only comprises 10 nations at most. Like Cricket, a similar situation exists in Rugby. Football operates at a much higher level. Australia merely reaching the 2006 round of 16 in the FIFA World Cup ranks greater than any RWC, CWC or Ashes & Tri-Nations victory they’ve ever achieved!

You have an excellent memory hhm!

I hardly remember any of the stuff I was mumbling, but certainly it was heartening to find some positive feedback.

Indeed, where is betterdays?

Maehara if you have a way of contacting him on other forum aside ZCF, please ask him to come back? ;)

pariah
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Re: Surely you could have acknowledged that I was completely right?

Post by pariah » Thu Nov 09, 2017 11:09 pm

Increasingly there is nowhere to hide for these journos. Still it's spin after spin by them as they gradually reveal things. Would have saved themselves the trouble by jus having my posts printed because they do read them, and they know they are true.

What is most important is that the fact that us$19m still exists and that ZC were duped into pissing off India(BCCI). ZIM got nothing out of dancing to the ICC tune.

Like it or not the egg won't be in my face.

We still need to know how much the Rising Stars tour cost. No one is saying anything.

Kriterion_BD
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Re: Surely you could have acknowledged that I was completely right?

Post by Kriterion_BD » Thu Nov 09, 2017 11:23 pm

pariah wrote:
Thu Nov 09, 2017 11:09 pm
Increasingly there is nowhere to hide for these journos. Still it's spin after spin by them as they gradually reveal things. Would have saved themselves the trouble by jus having my posts printed because they do read them, and they know they are true.

What is most important is that the fact that us$19m still exists and that ZC were duped into pissing off India(BCCI). ZIM got nothing out of dancing to the ICC tune.

Like it or not the egg won't be in my face.

We still need to know how much the Rising Stars tour cost. No one is saying anything.
Yeah but what idiot would rather appoint the same stumbling idiots who produced that 19m debt.

The indigenous Zimmers had no interest in this game except to loot the money from it. Do guys like Chikonga even know the rules to the game?

All of the Asian boards (barring Sri Lanka) are quite well financially...it makes sense to let them run cricket.
Truth is on the side of the oppressed; its against the oppressor. Time is on the side of the oppressed; its against the oppressor. You don't need anything else.
[Malcolm X]

TapsC
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Re: Surely you could have acknowledged that I was completely right?

Post by TapsC » Fri Nov 10, 2017 12:28 am

As I have always said putting people into one box because of the mistakes of others is unfair. it really hasn't been just indigenous Zimbos alone but people don't want to hear that truth. in fact I wonder who was behind the TV deal which is not generating any money. Remember that 10 year TV deal which was signed when Alistair Cambpell was pulling the strings with Manase? whatever happened to that?

It's like us blaming white people for Mark Vermeulen burning down the academy. how much was it worth? In the end every individual is responsible for their own actions and it must end there. I also know from first hand experience how some white people will be stealing from tour funds at schools but the issues are dealt with internally and swept under the carpet to avoid the embarrassment of a white person rotting in an African jail. corruption is a universal problem

Kriterion_BD
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Re: Surely you could have acknowledged that I was completely right?

Post by Kriterion_BD » Fri Nov 10, 2017 1:14 am

TapsC wrote:
Fri Nov 10, 2017 12:28 am
As I have always said putting people into one box because of the mistakes of others is unfair. it really hasn't been just indigenous Zimbos alone but people don't want to hear that truth. in fact I wonder who was behind the TV deal which is not generating any money. Remember that 10 year TV deal which was signed when Alistair Cambpell was pulling the strings with Manase? whatever happened to that?

It's like us blaming white people for Mark Vermeulen burning down the academy. how much was it worth? In the end every individual is responsible for their own actions and it must end there. I also know from first hand experience how some white people will be stealing from tour funds at schools but the issues are dealt with internally and swept under the carpet to avoid the embarrassment of a white person rotting in an African jail. corruption is a universal problem
Well said.

Its only an issue of color because pariah makes it one. Chigoka was in charge for 25 years, which means all looting was done under a black man's watch. Of course whites can loot too...they pillaged most of Africa and Asia for centuries but we are talking about the ZC here. Alistair Campbell...how much of the 19 million in debt is attributable to him?
Truth is on the side of the oppressed; its against the oppressor. Time is on the side of the oppressed; its against the oppressor. You don't need anything else.
[Malcolm X]

ZIMDOGGY
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Re: Surely you could have acknowledged that I was completely right?

Post by ZIMDOGGY » Fri Nov 10, 2017 1:35 am

Ali Campbell’s reputation is passively getting worse in this forum by hearsay, someone says something and it’s taken on as fact by the next person. I’ve observed this over the last few months.

Ali Campbell may not have been a good spender, I’m not sure. I really am not.

However, let’s remember one thing. Anything of note that happened between 2010 and 2015 was under Camepbells watch.

If nothing else, he was the only one that got shit done.
Cricinfo profile of the 'James Bond' of cricket:

FULL NAME: Angus James Mackay
BORN: 13 June 1967, Harare
KNOWN AS: Gus Mackay

'The' Gus Mackay.

Hero.
Sportsman.
Artist.
Player.

**
Q. VUSI SIBANDA, WHERE DO YOU HOP?

A. UNDA DA ENTERTAINMENT CENTRE*

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