[Series Thread]: 2018 ICC World Cup Qualifier | Non-Zim Matches

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foreignfield
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Re: [Series Thread]: 2018 ICC World Cup Qualifier | Non-Zim Matches

Post by foreignfield »

Interesting thoughts about sweeping above.

One thing I've noticed which fills me with a modicum of optimism is that our guys seem to play the sweep better at home where they are familiar with the conditions. I suspect it has more to do with the bounce than the turn. I can't back it up by any stats but I feel we see a lot more top-edged sweeps or lbws on tour than at HSC or QSC. I also think we didn't have too many complaints about the sweep during the WC down under where the bounce is normally very true. An absolute nightmare series was that in the Carribean with the ball bouncing extravagantly for Shillingford--until then I had BT and Williams down as great players of spin, but there it became obvious that they couldn't adjust their game, they kept on sweeping and reverse-sweeping to very little effect ... which in turn fills me with a lot less confidence for tomorrow's next encounter with Rashid :roll:

I hope the young man feels the burden of the captaincy and the aspirations of the whole country :mrgreen:

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CrimsonAvenger
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Re: [Series Thread]: 2018 ICC World Cup Qualifier | Non-Zim Matches

Post by CrimsonAvenger »

foreignfield wrote:
Mon Mar 05, 2018 9:08 am
I hope the young man feels the burden of the captaincy and the aspirations of the whole country
Amen :D

Sounded very familiar. Aha! K C Sangakkara on stump mic when Pollock came into bat - CWC 2003 :). Hope this statement has the same effect too...

Kriterion_BD
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Re: [Series Thread]: 2018 ICC World Cup Qualifier | Non-Zim Matches

Post by Kriterion_BD »

jaybro wrote:
Mon Mar 05, 2018 8:57 am
You’re right about Asian players sweeping less frequently but you’re wrong about it being easier to play cross bat shots when it’s swinging and spinning.

When the ball isn’t moving it’s easiest to play straight or cross bat shots because you can trust the the trajectory of the ball after it pitches. Once the ball is moving you have to either get to the pitch of the ball to nullify the spin or swing or play very late which is probably easier against swing or seam than spin.

The best way to play spin is to use your feet and play straight.
Well with seam/swing (ie pace bowling) - cross batted shots are kind of irrelevant because if the ball is swinging its going to be too full to play cross bat shots to begin with. You can have seam movement with shorter lengths, and yes you can get in trouble with cross batted shots if there is significant movement off the deck. However, with swing or seam the primary threat is being caught behind, being bowled, or lbw. Those dismissals are relatively less likely if you play cross batted shots. Of course a short ball won't hit the stumps or the pads either way.

My cross bat comments are for spin bowling on turning tracks. You're right the best idea is to play straight, but its exceedingly difficult to bat against the turning ball. I'd wager its easier to score a 100 on a greentop with the ball swinging and seaming than it is to score a 100 on a square turner.

ZIM have mostly played against AFG since the last World Cup. Thats supplanted that old BD-ZIM rivalry now. ZIM have lost each series due to their batting deficiencies. The ZIM batting lineup is actually superior to the Afghan one when it comes to skills and technique. They are roughly equal in terms of temperament. The only advantage the AFG batsmen have is that they are mentally stronger and make smarter decisions. Ultimately thats the most important factor. 90% of batting happens from the neck up.
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Re: [Series Thread]: 2018 ICC World Cup Qualifier | Non-Zim Matches

Post by sloandog »

CrimsonAvenger wrote:
Mon Mar 05, 2018 9:14 am
foreignfield wrote:
Mon Mar 05, 2018 9:08 am
I hope the young man feels the burden of the captaincy and the aspirations of the whole country
Amen :D

Sounded very familiar. Aha! K C Sangakkara on stump mic when Pollock came into bat - CWC 2003 :). Hope this statement has the same effect too...
I hope they crumble.

They are very talented yes, but at the same time their squad stinks of arrogance and have arrived in Zim with arguably the biggest ego. That defeat to Scotland yesterday was a real humbling experience for them no doubt, and I'm hoping they have been brought right back down to earth. The defeat also shows the strength of the associates this time round. In fact, would we all agree that the teams in this qualifying tournament are as strong as they've ever been? I've never seen so much depth in the Dutch squad; Scotland have shown that they are a team on the rise; Ireland are Ireland and have some great players in their side, plus the confidence to match their skill; West Indies are still dangerous if not unpredictable; UAE have some good players; Nepal showed they can bat and Zimbabwe have put out the best squad they have done in years. Very very competative

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Andybligzz
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Re: [Series Thread]: 2018 ICC World Cup Qualifier | Non-Zim Matches

Post by Andybligzz »

sloandog wrote:
Mon Mar 05, 2018 9:27 am
CrimsonAvenger wrote:
Mon Mar 05, 2018 9:14 am
foreignfield wrote:
Mon Mar 05, 2018 9:08 am
I hope the young man feels the burden of the captaincy and the aspirations of the whole country
Amen :D

Sounded very familiar. Aha! K C Sangakkara on stump mic when Pollock came into bat - CWC 2003 :). Hope this statement has the same effect too...
I hope they crumble.

They are very talented yes, but at the same time their squad stinks of arrogance and have arrived in Zim with arguably the biggest ego. That defeat to Scotland yesterday was a real humbling experience for them no doubt, and I'm hoping they have been brought right back down to earth. The defeat also shows the strength of the associates this time round. In fact, would we all agree that the teams in this qualifying tournament are as strong as they've ever been? I've never seen so much depth in the Dutch squad; Scotland have shown that they are a team on the rise; Ireland are Ireland and have some great players in their side, plus the confidence to match their skill; West Indies are still dangerous if not unpredictable; UAE have some good players; Nepal showed they can bat and Zimbabwe have put out the best squad they have done in years. Very very competative
Well said Sloan couldn’t agree more with what you have said
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Googly
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Re: [Series Thread]: 2018 ICC World Cup Qualifier | Non-Zim Matches

Post by Googly »

You will be astounded at how many good batsmen completely predetermine a sweep. Obviously you need to be thinking about it, but you need another shot in mind if it’s just out of reach. So there’s two mind sets-
I’m going to sweep the next ball and if it’s not there I’ll change. Or- if I can reach I will sweep otherwise play normally. It’s a subtle yet important difference. Sometimes guys will sweep a ball they haven’t covered, but you have to be damned good and it’s just a matter of time.
If it can be reached and it’s just outside leg the paddle or a bit on it is easy. Outside off and you’re taking LBW out of it if you take it off the outside of your pad ie hitting it a bit squarer. If u take it off the inside or clear your leg slightly then LBW comes into play. If you haven’t got a tv umpire they’re going to stick you anyway.
Sweeping on stumps is the killer. You have to have your A game if you’re going to do it regularly.
Again most predetermine a reverse, but the good reversers have a bail out. The real good ones probably wait for the right ball- so the shot is in their head, but they’re waiting for the right ball. Such slightly different mind sets.
There are so many drills to get technique correct. My favorite being taking it off the inside of the pad to hit it straighter, off the middle to hit it squarer and off the outside to hit it behind.
But the most useful is to stop you completely predetermining. So I say off 4th stump reverse, off middle and off play straight and off leg sweep. You’d be amazed at how many good batters get it wrong.
You have to be an inherently good sweeper. Everyone has a couple of favorite shots, and some that are a no go, yet all our guys will have a harry at a sweep? It’s actually safer to come down the wicket and take your chances than take the knee if you’re not confident about it.
Bounce and variable bounce will undo you more than turn.

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Re: [Series Thread]: 2018 ICC World Cup Qualifier | Non-Zim Matches

Post by Googly »

I’ve just spent time with three guys sweeping. One of them a beautiful batsman. He will get 8/10 right, and he’s damned good. If you get him to play straight he gets them all right, but of course there’s not necessarily a run on offer. Bizarrely he’s more consistent reversing. If you get a reverse wrong there’s usually only one catcher. If you top edge a sweep there’s at least 2.

Googly
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Re: [Series Thread]: 2018 ICC World Cup Qualifier | Non-Zim Matches

Post by Googly »

My point being 8/10 is not low risk. Then the last drill is you tell him there’s 20 deliveries and he’s got to sweep two in front, two behind and 2 reverse. The rest play straight, so he has to pick the right delivery. If he doesn’t get them out of the way early and has to play 6 towards the end the brain scrambles.

sloandog
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Re: [Series Thread]: 2018 ICC World Cup Qualifier | Non-Zim Matches

Post by sloandog »

The sweep is fine; runs can be found in areas which would otherwise be hard to get to and if applied correctly can really get a bowler thinking of what to do next. But reverse sweeping/slogging in the first over of a game (Mire) is just stupid. There were deliveries which were back of a length which could have been swatted over mid wicket, or punched back down for a single.

I'm hoping we play with slightly more respect tomorrow against Afghanistan, in terms of bringing out the sweep. The stink of arrogance (Shazad, Nabi, Rashid to name a few) is strong but they are damn good players, and need to be treated with respect when required.

I'm hoping Jarvis is dropped tomorrow in place of Blessing. He caused some real problems in the last game (I think) against the Afghans with his pace and bounce, where they showed their vulnerability big time.

Would love big Cephas to get going early on tomorrow. If him and Mire can get 50 off the first 5 or 6 say, it'll rattle Rashid Khan and he may bring himself on earlier, which is good for us as he'll have less to bowl at the back end of the innings. Lots of if's there, but if and when they come off, we could really take off. I'm excited

foreignfield
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Re: [Series Thread]: 2018 ICC World Cup Qualifier | Non-Zim Matches

Post by foreignfield »

sloandog wrote:
Mon Mar 05, 2018 11:49 am
Would love big Cephas to get going early on tomorrow. If him and Mire can get 50 off the first 5 or 6 say, it'll rattle Rashid Khan and he may bring himself on earlier, which is good for us as he'll have less to bowl at the back end of the innings. Lots of if's there, but if and when they come off, we could really take off. I'm excited
If Cephas comes off tomorrow I'm prepared to eat a whole pack of humble pie and call it a piece of tactical genius not to pick him for the UAE series :P

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