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In this forum we wrote off Chibhabha and Vusi after they gave us 10 years of pain. I am just failing to understand why we stick with Mire and PJ as automatic picks when their struggles are now very clear for everybody to see. I want to put some perspective to their careers and compare them to those 2 guys who people dont want to see play anymore.

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The only difference between Mire and PJ is actually that century in Sri Lanka. These guys have played 40 and 39 games respectively. At what point do we start looking at other options?

3 half centuries after almost 40 games is shocking. Vusi scored 21 half centuries in 127 games. Chamu scored 16 in 103 games. Vusi and Chamu also didnt play so many games against Afghanistan the UAE Scotland The Netherlands etc yet they have better averages.

If you actually look at PJ and Mire's career trajectories they are on course to score 5 half centuries like Waller did after almost 80 games. Their averages are shocking.

Something isnt right with their automatic selections. We need to start looking elsewhere in ODIs as far as im concerned. Both of those guys have flawed techniques. Mire's foot movement is poor. PJ cant rotate the strike. Those are 2 critical abilities you need to have to survive at the highest level. In terms of technique Vusi actually beats them both.

When should our patience run out? I personally think this should be enough. I will give another example of a guy who was thrown away after a similar number of games for the exact same reasons. Richmond Mutumbami. He also had 3 half centuries after 31 games

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PJ is actually the most biased ODI selection probably in the history of Zimbabwe cricket. He has 4 List A half centuries!!! This is after 88 games.1 century. Our domestic cricket is so poor. If you average less than 20 in the Zimbabwe domestic scene you dont deserve to play at international level. At least Waller was a domestic league basher

At least Mire has 4 centuries and 10 half centuries in List A cricket and averages 30

Agree. Those two, on form, should already have been out of the XI at the very least, and if not, should be on the brink. But in reality, Mire might have bought a lot of time for himself with the T20 tri-series performance, in ZC context.

Moor is definitely on borrowed time he seems to be that guy that trains hard and is a great team mate, the new coach wanted him to be captain

Mire is definitely still living off his reputation and potential, he did do very well in the home t20 tri series though. For me he’s great in batsman friendly conditions where he can use his power hitting but if there is spin, swing or seam he struggles.

I think he might be best used as a proper all rounder batting @7 and bowling seam, he’d obviously have to work on his bowling though.

Someone like Vusi or Chamu really don’t have reason to feel hard done by they’ve had plenty of chances and years of failure. It is hard to understand how Tari isn’t in the side after his great African t20 Cup form.

Moor's List A record is awful. He is in at the moment on the strength of test efforts and the lack of Raza. And the lack of credible 20 something options. Needs to improve or be left out.

For FOUR years we didn't play Cremer in the one day team because he was considered a Test specialist.

If that criteria could be applied to someone as good as Cremer, I don't see why Moor can't be considered a Test specialist? Especially now that we actually do play the odd Test match.

Play Moor in every Zim A match that is played, and if his limited overs form happens to improve then bring him back into the national team. Otherwise guys like Musakanda and Murray should be given opportunities.

TapsC wrote: ↑

Sun Oct 07, 2018 6:57 am

PJ is actually the most biased ODI selection probably in the history of Zimbabwe cricket.

I agree with almost everything, but this is where you lost me a bit.

To be fair, I think PJs problem is not him as a player, but that he is not settled in the side. Sometimes plays as a keeper, sometimes does not. Sometimes up the order, sometimes down the order. I think he is best suited as a test playing opener, but has not had the right coaching to be given the chance and settle in to that spot.

As for Mire, I have said that him and Hammy are not the best openers we have. Mire should be coming in lower down the order like Gilchrist did in Tests, but purely for his ability to hit the ball far. Only problem is that he is not as consistent as Gilchrist and unfortunately we have players who seem to be untouchable.

Maybe I went too far with the most biased selection part

The team player thing is true. As for Mire I think he needs to start bowling again. He is probably faster than our 2 seamers. I remember him bowling in the mid 130s at some point. Your value to the team drops significantly when you are an all rounder then suddenly decide to stop bowling. Just look at Elton and Chamu. The only thing Zimbabwe has an advantage in I think is that our teams are littered with potential all rounders. I dont know why guys like Elton Hami Chamu and now Mire were just allowed to stop bowling. We could easily play a 8-3 lineup if these guys continued bowling.

TapsC wrote: ↑

Sun Oct 07, 2018 12:55 pm

I dont know why guys like Elton Hami Chamu and now Mire were just allowed to stop bowling. We could easily play a 8-3 lineup if these guys continued bowling.

Because none of those 3 are good enough to consistently bowl 5 overs an innings. Hami is a golden arm, but thats only if he bowls the odd over every other game. If he starts bowling 3-4 overs consistently he will be milked for easy runs. Chamu is the same. Elton is the only one who had bowling potential but that was 10 or so years ago.

Williams and Raza are plenty good as all rounders. And if you want a fast bowling one, Shingi would probably be the best option. Or hell, even Tiripano but Tiripano's bowling won't scare too many people.

zimbos_05 wrote: ↑

Sun Oct 07, 2018 12:18 pm

As for Mire, I have said that him and Hammy are not the best openers we have.

Really?? We have better openers than Hamilton Masakadza???

IMO he is still the best player of the new ball than anyone in the country, BT included.

TapsC wrote: ↑

Sun Oct 07, 2018 12:55 pm

Maybe I went too far with the most biased selection part

The team player thing is true. As for Mire I think he needs to start bowling again. He is probably faster than our 2 seamers. I remember him bowling in the mid 130s at some point. Your value to the team drops significantly when you are an all rounder then suddenly decide to stop bowling. Just look at Elton and Chamu. The only thing Zimbabwe has an advantage in I think is that our teams are littered with potential all rounders. I dont know why guys like Elton Hami Chamu and now Mire were just allowed to stop bowling. We could easily play a 8-3 lineup if these guys continued bowling.

He is simply not good enough for ODI cricket an average of 19 and strike rate of 62 after 40 odd matches he wont change anytime soon .