2nd ODI ZIMBABWE VS SRILANKA

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Googly
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Re: 2nd ODI ZIMBABWE VS SRILANKA

Post by Googly »

TapsC2 wrote:
Thu Jan 20, 2022 7:40 am
There will also be a lot of kids who grew up in the diaspora that could be convinced to come back and play. We will see a lot of UK and SA raised kids popping up in all sports over the next few decades. Think about some of those reserves who suddenly pitched up in the Caribbean or the Zim kid who is a reserve for the SA u19 side. Or kids who just do their high school in SA like Taruvinga. I guess that is where somebody like Jarvis could come in and convince them.you need somebody you respect to do that.

The truth is you only need maybe 2 of those kind of guys out of 15 players every cycle. It's very possible
I don't agree about the 2 per cycle.
We need a few of them back to strengthen our franchise system. There needs to be real competition for spots. There's dead wood. Clearly it's not feasible to make a decent living in franchise, but it should be.

TapsC2
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Re: 2nd ODI ZIMBABWE VS SRILANKA

Post by TapsC2 »

Googly wrote:
Thu Jan 20, 2022 11:08 am
TapsC2 wrote:
Thu Jan 20, 2022 7:40 am
There will also be a lot of kids who grew up in the diaspora that could be convinced to come back and play. We will see a lot of UK and SA raised kids popping up in all sports over the next few decades. Think about some of those reserves who suddenly pitched up in the Caribbean or the Zim kid who is a reserve for the SA u19 side. Or kids who just do their high school in SA like Taruvinga. I guess that is where somebody like Jarvis could come in and convince them.you need somebody you respect to do that.

The truth is you only need maybe 2 of those kind of guys out of 15 players every cycle. It's very possible
I don't agree about the 2 per cycle.
We need a few of them back to strengthen our franchise system. There needs to be real competition for spots. There's dead wood. Clearly it's not feasible to make a decent living in franchise, but it should be.
This last cycle we had Myers, Wes, Marumani, Chesa, Shumba, Chirawu and Nyangani all being involved after the world cup 1 way or the other. Hopefully we can have the same happening again. That's 7 guys Added to the system. 6 for sure plus Myers and Dane in the UK making it 8 guys from the last cycle.

Ruwisi who was injured last time now with the SA u19s plus Bawa still with the current lot. That's 10 guys. Impressive

ZIMDOGGY
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Re: 2nd ODI ZIMBABWE VS SRILANKA

Post by ZIMDOGGY »

zimbos_05 wrote:
Thu Jan 20, 2022 9:40 am
Googly wrote:
Thu Jan 20, 2022 5:52 am
This may be the only forum where such topics can be discussed openly. We haven't really flogged it to death either because the reality is only just setting in that 4 of our best players are in the departure lounge and adequate replacements have not emerged. Also only a small number of forumites actually live here and yet they are the most pessimistic and that's not a coincidence. It's very unfortunate there aren't more locals, there used to be. It indicates a loss of interest. Is there more interest in our cricket externally than internally? That would be sad.

Were I in ZC or a supporter I'd engage on this forum because a lot of people read it, yet they steer well clear. If they had clear policies, a road map forward, intent to administrate well, sort out past mistakes then good conversations could be had.
They don't even make regular public statements nor keep people abreast of news through their own formal channels.
If they were transparent, answered questions openly and honestly and tried to restore public confidence they may actually get some Corporate interest. Its sad that their need for silence outweighs the need for Corporate sponsorship.
Theyre far from stupid, they've weighed that up and decided silence is the best policy. Clearly the money coming in is enough :lol:
Their PR guys must have the best job on the planet- don't come to work, don't open your mouth and do collect 3k every month.
Never thought I would, but I agree with so much of this post.

In saying that, it is ZC, so asking them to be stupid and upfront is nigh on impossible.

If there's one player I would throw money at, it's Cartwright. He's out of the aus set up and I'm sure he'd be enticed by the prospect in playing International T20 world cup this year. I know ZC would want players paying Zim domestic, but honestly, I think it's a dumb rule. At least not until they can get their house in order. I would allow him to stay and play in in Aus because will be up against world class players and will develop well. He's had a good BBL too. I know it's wishful thinking, but in a proper run set up, that's what I would do.
Yeah I agree. He makes almost every other countries T20 team, but is stuck behind a team full of premium IPL talent. He is on record as saying he grew up wanting to play for Zim as a kid, is a seeming all rounder and would now qualify for Zimbabwe as it’s been 4 years. Still young. He instantly solves so rims y problems and plugs gaps all over the side. Would be captain material.
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Re: 2nd ODI ZIMBABWE VS SRILANKA

Post by ZIMDOGGY »

lobsang wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 8:02 pm
Honestly, it is annoying to go through these sad future scenarios and to hear members on this forum's predictions of what could happen after the trio of Williams, Ervine and Raza retire. Let's remind ourselves of the fact that Ervine went to play in Ireland with the hope that he could play for them and if the Irish board saw in him something special, he would have represented Ireland by now. In Raza's case too, He would have been wooed by PCB to play for them like what they did to Usman Qadir, the son of great Abdul Qadir. Usman was on the cusp of playing for Australia but finally he chose his birth-country.

Shumba, Madhevere and Bawa and even Myers, if he makes a comeback in the near future, have what it takes to become as good as these three if not better, it will all come down to their willingness to put in the hard yards. And remember we are not hoping for them to be like Kohli, Maxwell and ABD. there are many pessimistic souls on this forum. 2004 talent drought was way worse than what the departure of these three would do to say the least. Almost 15 to 16 players left Zimbabwe cricket for greener pasture . And that kind of players' exodus could have crippled even BCCI, CA and ECB for 4 to five years. Williams, Ervine and BT would have disappeared into oblivion if they played for India, Australia or England, considering the abundance of talents in those countries, coz they struggled initially in their careers. They kept getting opportunities in Zimbabwe thanks to the small pool of talents in the country and they got better as the years passed by with experience.

Burl can become a better player than Sikandar Raza and for that to happen, the administration or selectors must put some faith and support that he is important part of the squad moving forward, and Shumba by his age is way well ahead of Ervine in my opinion. And Madhevere is as talented as they come and not many would have said such things about BT at Madhevere's age when he burst onto the international scene. BT, Williams, Ervine and Raza are good players but honestly they are not irreplaceable at all. There is every chance that Myers and Murray may return in the near future and ZC will dangle an enticing carrot to bring them back for sure at some stage and then there is this Bawa kid, and Marumani could work on his batting coz he is extremely young. From bowling point of view, Ngarava and Muzarabani can easily serve Zim for another 8 to 10 years and few other will definitely emerge in between.

Now this part is very important as far as I am concerned, If I were Mukuhulani, I would not be that stupid to let the game die coz I and my colleague ( all corrupted ) can keep on milking ICC funds as long as we can field a team that can challenge and beat the number 6, 7 and 8 ranked teams more often than not and I will do everything in my power to assemble a team that can get us to ICC global events so that we can keep our pockets full of $€€$. Remember before 2019 World cup qualifiers took place, they did everything in their hands to bring back BT and Jarvis.

So after these three are gone, yes Zimbabwe cricket may suffer defeats that they would not suffer with the present team at the hands of lesser known teams for a year or two but I think these dorks at ZC will devise something to keep the engine working for as long as they can so that they pockets will not run out of those $$$$€€€€.
Optimism is good but there are some issues with the above.
1- In 2005 Zimbabwean schools cricket was stil considered one of the best in the world and the production line of kids was excellent. Part of this is why Bvute was happy to say goodbye to many at once. He banked on talent being there on the back of the good system at the time. Every article referred to the junior pathways as world class back then. I havent heard that being mentioned since mid to late 00's.

2-BRMT was considered a child prodigy from day one. Hence why he debuted in the logan Cup at 17 and played internationally 2 months after hid 18th bday. He also was pretty good early on too.

3- ICC have traditionally given 12 mil a year to ZC. You think Ervine and Taylor and Jarvis and all that would come back if they only got 4 million like Ireland? with no spomsorship? thats how its been but with waning attendance, participation results or care factor its possible. Even probable.

4- Is it truly good to always be optimistic? The old anecdote of not speaking up leads to condoning the issue. What if we applied this to another issue, like the 19s cheating thing talked about this week. You could take a kriterion-like view of being sick of the topic or 'its just one single tournament but it will bite them in seniors' untol a kid gets brain damaged, others quit and the pakistani mens team are hobbling in the field because they are all too old (as Asif said). No one wants us to be more optimistic than the people in charge. You do have to balance it and pick your spots though i agree, otherwise it's just doom and gloom.

5- Too late to get Murray back. Even if he came back cap in hand willing to suck dick for a gig, he hasnt played for 5 years! How good can someone be after 5 years out? Logan Cup good? sure! But no one can be international quality after 5 years of doing something else in the peak of your development.

I do like your thinking in yout last paragraph though. Thats speaking the language these guys understand. It is absolutely critical to retain our top guys for as long as their body holds and to throw hard cash at Curran, Schadendorf, Byrom, Welch, Muyeye and even Crtwright and Ballance and see what sticks. All those guys return, or most of them, and we are 9th in the world comfortably.

Although that would mean a 'white' team and that stupidly makes ZC burn up inside and makes them feel like cucks. Although i see no problem with a future of white batters and black bowlers. Which is where its headed if managed correctly.
Cricinfo profile of the 'James Bond' of cricket:

FULL NAME: Angus James Mackay
BORN: 13 June 1967, Harare
KNOWN AS: Gus Mackay

'The' Gus Mackay.

Hero.
Sportsman.
Artist.
Player.

**
Q. VUSI SIBANDA, WHERE DO YOU HOP?

A. UNDA DA ENTERTAINMENT CENTRE*

ZIMDOGGY
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Re: 2nd ODI ZIMBABWE VS SRILANKA

Post by ZIMDOGGY »

lobsang wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 8:37 pm
lobsang wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 8:33 pm
sloandog wrote:
Wed Jan 19, 2022 8:21 pm
I don't really agree with a lot of what you've put if I'm honest.

In 2004, yes, the players exodus almost crippled the system and the blatant racism from within ZC was much less covered up as it is now. However, the system which brought in Ervine, Williams and BT was still around and thriving. The club system was strong, the Under 19's had just had a golden time of it at the CWC and there was genuinely a lot of talent I the wings, they simply were not ready and that's the bottom line.

I don't think many on this forum would disagree that Taylor turned some heads when he played against Sri Lanka as an 18 year old. From day one he was hyped up and rightly so, he was as gifted as any batter we've had since Andy Flower, period. He's been our best ODI player ever and from the start you could tell he had what it took.

My point is that the current lads in the squad need another two years to mature, and I don't know if the likes of Ervine and Williams will last that long. Again, they were part of a system which has been long dismantled and left to memory, to riminis about and long for. That system gave the country a lot of solid FC and international players. Even 2 years later, the under 19's Heald their own and had such talent. Cremer, meth, Nicholson, Mire, Higgins, Ballance, Querl, Williams himself...they all came from that system of club crixket and solid school cricket. It doesn't exist now mate and the situation we had in 2004 is going to look very rosy compared to now. We have a handful of potential international players coming through, that's it, and they are ready.

So the big question is will Mukuhulani and co do something, if the situation of the game become such poor? If I were him, I would do everything in my power to bring back those Zimbos playing oversea. I would go entice and assure those talented kids to come back and play for the country coz AT THE END OF THE DAY it is all about money and a competent and good Zimbabwe team means nothing but fat pockets to these thugs at ZC.

Like they say " do not kill the cow if you want to enjoy the milk ", these crooks may have some tricks up their sleeve to survive the cow.
It seems obvious to you, I and everyone else here, but the african mentality is more, sell the golden cow and go buy bling with it.

like those receivers of the land repossession who got that grant from the Zim government and all went out to buy Range rovers immediately and the farm went to dust or at low capacity.
Cricinfo profile of the 'James Bond' of cricket:

FULL NAME: Angus James Mackay
BORN: 13 June 1967, Harare
KNOWN AS: Gus Mackay

'The' Gus Mackay.

Hero.
Sportsman.
Artist.
Player.

**
Q. VUSI SIBANDA, WHERE DO YOU HOP?

A. UNDA DA ENTERTAINMENT CENTRE*

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