Zimbabwe Vs Ireland | 3rd T20I | 15th Jan 2023

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secretzimbo
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Re: Zimbabwe Vs Ireland | 3rd T20I | 15th Jan 2023

Post by secretzimbo »

zimbos_05 wrote:
Mon Jan 16, 2023 10:48 pm
He was dropped at the WC because of his scandal, if memory serves me correctly.

No doubt Jongwe has some quality as a death bowler but if he is only being picked as a specialist two over bowler, how is that fair. I'm not denying his strength in that area or his skill with it, but just stating that it's unfair how one group of players get treated, and another group do. For all the positives on the field, there are still many things that need fixing. a
I don't think he was dropped because of his sponsor stuff was he? I think that just came out at basically the same time? Either way a minute ago you were saying everyone ignored that episode but now you are saying he was dropped for it. :?

He didn't play well in the world cup. It was fair he was dropped after a bad run.

As for 'its unfair how one group of players get treated' I know what groups you are referring to, but for the first time in an extremely long time I don't think thats the case at the moment whatsoever. Certainly not in the national team currently.

As for him being a specialist two over bowler, he did of course bowl three and usually does. It's T20 cricket, every successful T20 side in the world is literally built on specific roles and guys executing skills in very specific narrow situations. Jongwe's current role as a death specialist is literally what every T20 franchise side in the world has. I'm not sure how much T20 cricket you watch.

Tbh I think it's a really hard argument to sell that Evans is a better T20 bowler than Jongwe currently. Out of interest, did you watch the three Ireland matches?

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zimbos_05
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Re: Zimbabwe Vs Ireland | 3rd T20I | 15th Jan 2023

Post by zimbos_05 »

secretzimbo wrote:
Mon Jan 16, 2023 11:29 pm


I don't think he was dropped because of his sponsor stuff was he? I think that just came out at basically the same time? Either way a minute ago you were saying everyone ignored that episode but now you are saying he was dropped for it. :?
One game then was back straight in the side. Barely any comment on it or form of punishment, which he should have served. It also paints ZC in bad light. Remember when Burl asked for shoes on twitter.
secretzimbo wrote:
Mon Jan 16, 2023 11:29 pm
As for him being a specialist two over bowler, he did of course bowl three and usually does. It's T20 cricket, every successful T20 side in the world is literally built on specific roles and guys executing skills in very specific narrow situations. Jongwe's current role as a death specialist is literally what every T20 franchise side in the world has. I'm not sure how much T20 cricket you watch.

Tbh I think it's a really hard argument to sell that Evans is a better T20 bowler than Jongwe currently. Out of interest, did you watch the three Ireland matches?
I'm not against Jongwe. If he comes in and regularly does the job, fair enough. Just think it's unfair that Evans gets chopped and changed so often, yet Wes for example keeps struggling and keeps retaining his spot. That's all i'm saying. There needs to be a consistency to it.

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Re: Zimbabwe Vs Ireland | 3rd T20I | 15th Jan 2023

Post by CrimsonAvenger »

Don't see any controversy here. If the management can see that one guy doesn't have too many variations and another has, in this particular format, the one with variations gets preferred.

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jaybro
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Re: Zimbabwe Vs Ireland | 3rd T20I | 15th Jan 2023

Post by jaybro »

Yeah I think selection has been pretty good of late, of course we all have our opinions but I think to say certain groups of players are being treated better is off the mark.

Jongwe, Evans and Chatara all have been left out of games across the World Cup & Ireland series, I don’t think any of them have been unfairly treated.

Evans is great one game then average the next, just like the WC where he bowled well v Pakistan & was the hero, then the next game v Bangladesh at the Gabba ( which should have suited him) he was all over the shop.
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Re: Zimbabwe Vs Ireland | 3rd T20I | 15th Jan 2023

Post by TapsC2 »

Competition is good guys. A very good thing. It looks like Steve Kirby is really putting his all into this job and having options is a good thing. Knowing there is somebody ready to take your spot any day is actually a great motivating factor. Our batting is struggling because of a lack of options and I'm sure that once everybody is available we will see the likes of Wes getting dropped too, especially after how Kaia has performed compared to the kids.

I am more in favour of playing both Jongwe and Evans in the situation we are in right now where senior guys are injured. I honestly don't think Munyonga can offer too much more than what Jongwe could offer with the bat in my opinion. Although Munyonga does seem like the day he figures it out he will go big

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Re: Zimbabwe Vs Ireland | 3rd T20I | 15th Jan 2023

Post by Kriterion_BD »

jaybro wrote:
Tue Jan 17, 2023 1:15 am
Yeah I think selection has been pretty good of late, of course we all have our opinions but I think to say certain groups of players are being treated better is off the mark.

Jongwe, Evans and Chatara all have been left out of games across the World Cup & Ireland series, I don’t think any of them have been unfairly treated.

Evans is great one game then average the next, just like the WC where he bowled well v Pakistan & was the hero, then the next game v Bangladesh at the Gabba ( which should have suited him) he was all over the shop.
The Gabba is one the bouncier tracks in Australia from what I have heard - not like Perth but not docile like the SCG either. To really extract something from there one would either have to be express pace or Muzurabani height. Blessing can get bounce bowling 130 on almost any surface due to his extreme height. Evans to me looks to be around 6'2" which is tall-ish from a fast bowling perspective but not overly so. And he only bowls 125-130 range with his effort ball going around 135. Not quick enough to rampage unless its the WACA.
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zimbos_05
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Re: Zimbabwe Vs Ireland | 3rd T20I | 15th Jan 2023

Post by zimbos_05 »

I'd like to clarify. I'm not saying its a controversy or a major issue. I merely stated that I found it weird he gets dropped after 1 bad game. Perhaps a case of try and work with him rather than keep drop him after one bad game.

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Re: Zimbabwe Vs Ireland | 3rd T20I | 15th Jan 2023

Post by jaybro »

Kriterion_BD wrote:
Tue Jan 17, 2023 3:17 am


The Gabba is one the bouncier tracks in Australia from what I have heard - not like Perth but not docile like the SCG either. To really extract something from there one would either have to be express pace or Muzurabani height. Blessing can get bounce bowling 130 on almost any surface due to his extreme height. Evans to me looks to be around 6'2" which is tall-ish from a fast bowling perspective but not overly so. And he only bowls 125-130 range with his effort ball going around 135. Not quick enough to rampage unless its the WACA.
The Gabba is one of the best tracks for fast bowling in Australia, and on it's day ie 1st Test v Sth Africa it can be the best for fast bowling in the country. At domestic level it's always very bowler friendly with lots of games ending within 3 days, but usually in Tests they prepare a deck with less grass. I think history shows it's a result pitch, I can only remember a handful of draws there that were generally rain effected (apart from the 2011 Ashes).

If we go back to that game, Blessing took two wickets in two overs, but for some reason didn't bowl again. Taskin and Fizz from BD also bowled really well there, it was only Evans who really struggled. I like Evans, but as I said he's inconsistent and probably suited to longer formats rather than t20, not saying he can't be effective in this format, but it will be a 'horses for courses' type scenario for him I'd say.
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Re: Zimbabwe Vs Ireland | 3rd T20I | 15th Jan 2023

Post by Googly »

There's certainly way less bias than there used to be.
Evans knows what he has to do to keep his spot and he didn't have a good second game. Jongwe is thereabouts and it is a squad so I guess he gets a shot and he did well.

I see DH said he would sit with Mutendera to select for the ODI's. That was a small slip because it implies its just the two of them with M having the right of veto. Its certainly the hierarchy's check in case they don't like DH's team. I do believe there's a lot less interference now, but its a well known fact M does not like Evans. That has to be an interesting conversation to listen to. I don't think there's much that anybody in our system can tell DH about cricket.

Evans has to bowl faster, more consistently, have a couple of reliable change-ups and be a better batsman to become a permanent fixture, it's that simple. If Jongwe feels competitive Evans will never get away from him because he's also a talented guy. There's something not quite right in our system, particularly in the national squad- Jongwe has a lot of excess kilos. There's a few guys that are porky and it's not a good look.

Evans looks like he should be 10kph faster than he is. He's athletic, has a nice smooth repeater, certainly has a quick bouncer and yet his stock ball is medium.

This ODI squad will be interesting. DH said they'd be sticking with Marumani. He pumped up Madande's keeping which was fairly tidy, but there was nothing that stood out for me. I know he's new to this but those 3 deliveries he swung and missed at that almost cost us the game triggered an alarm bell for me. He needs to wake up, that was brainless.

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Re: Zimbabwe Vs Ireland | 3rd T20I | 15th Jan 2023

Post by Googly »

Also in that second game Madande got a buffet half tracker that he should have despatched into the 5th row and he pulled it low for 1. He didn't back himself and those 5 runs were critical. Look you can dissect anyone's innings and play the blame game, but it was at the death and he needed to clout that, it was a freebie. Anyway he will continue to get opportunities and he needs to grab them.

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