Northerns Vs Southerns (Sri Lanka Pre-Camp)

[CalZim]

The problem we have is that we can’t get away with just playing 2 pacers, so we need a third seamer.

This is between:
Jongwe
Tiripano
Chatara
Chivanga
Mumba

Only Tirapano and Jongwe can hold a bat, playing 3 number 11 bats against Sri lanka will probably not end well, especially if we have wellington batting at 8 as well who is only okay as a bat.

[secretzimbo]

Wellington has actually been in terrific form with the bat this season, so I think he's fine at 8. Can be considered an all rounder. We are also potentially playing either Raza or Burl at 7. So the batting is pretty deep already.

So 7 batsmen and an all-rounder. I wouldn't be too concerned about three tail enders after that tbh. We have to back our batsmen and stop having a defeatist mindset and relying on our bowlers to score runs.

Jongwe is fine as a number 9.

[lobsang]

So you are willing to sacrifice both Burl and Raza, two players who can both bat and bowl and even win matches for you, for Wellington? Seems like you have got very high opinion of Jongwe.

Not necessarily. I'd have one of them. I'm just not sure we ever need both of Raza and Burl in the same team, especially if they are going to bat at low as 7 and 8? Seems like a luxury, having both.

I don't think Jongwe or Wellington have done anything to lose their places yet. And I think we all know the selectors will pick them both as well, rightly or wrongly.

You and i both know how fragile Zim openers for last 15 plus years, the openers have been, for Zimbabwe, like a walking wickets for the oppositions. Batting deep is the only option for Zimbabwe to have any chance to beat Sri Lanka coz you know it has always been like 15-2 or 35-3 for Zimbabwe after first 7 to 9 overs.

[secretzimbo]

So you are willing to sacrifice both Burl and Raza, two players who can both bat and bowl and even win matches for you, for Wellington? Seems like you have got very high opinion of Jongwe.

Not necessarily. I'd have one of them. I'm just not sure we ever need both of Raza and Burl in the same team, especially if they are going to bat at low as 7 and 8? Seems like a luxury, having both.

I don't think Jongwe or Wellington have done anything to lose their places yet. And I think we all know the selectors will pick them both as well, rightly or wrongly.

You and i both know how fragile Zim openers for last 15 plus years, the openers have been, for Zimbabwe, like a walking wickets for the oppositions. Batting deep is the only option for Zimbabwe to have any chance to beat Sri Lanka coz you know it has always been like 15-2 or 35-3 for Zimbabwe after first 7 to 9 overs.

You are right tbf. But the answer is that the batsmen need to be better and perform better. If we are relying on number 8's and 9's to win us matches then we won't win many matches, ever.

[lobsang]

Meanwhile the covers are coming off, hopefully we will see a result and ideally overs will not get reduced.

[secretzimbo]

If we definitely want both Raza and Burl in the team, may I suggest that instead of dropping either Jongwe/Masakadza, we might be better off leaving Shumba out? I just feel 7 and 8 are too low for Raza/Burl, but 6 and 7 not so bad.

This feels like his weakest format and he isn't in outstanding form. It's harsh on him though. Unless he goes and gets a big score today.

Either way it's good that we have so many options in the lower-middle order and we are having this debate. If we had as many options at the top order as well then we'd be in a good position.

[Googly]

What unsubstantiated Anglophile nonsense is being spoken on this forum? . Just address me directly because I appear to be the only one trying vainly to explain how good their systems are. Please stop twisting words. I never once said there were millions of superior players in the UK. Please highlight where I said that and I will keep quiet.
Once again- I pointed out that if you have a few hundred players in one camp vs a million in another statistically the million camp will produce better players practically every time. If you can't understand that simple concept then this is heavy going. There are exceptions to every rule and Tawanda is a great one. He doesn't hopelessly outclass the numerous other really good players in England his age, not by a long shot. He had the best season that year and he's an enormous talent, but he's one of a handful of really good young batsmen. I'd hazard a guess there are quite a few 20-22 year olds on the circuit that have already done better than him so far, so your argument holds no water whatsoever. When you leave the hero cult of school cricket you enter the realm of pro cricket and and you're with the big fish, they don't give a fuck about schoolboy reputations. Hopefully he gets his breaks and delivers when it counts. People without an argument love to jump on an anomaly to prove their points.
Sure he had a good grounding here. Being in national age group sides and being coached 3 weeks of the year by an assigned Zim coach is not what made him a good player, by the way.
It's the coach who put in the hard yards throughout the years at school here that got him that scholarship that deserves a lot of the credit. Do you know who that is as a matter of interest?
Then there was the coach at Eastbourne who clearly helped him immensely as well. Then there was the 70 games of mostly high quality school cricket he played in those two years, then throw in some decent club cricket and a few County Two's games that he had to make him a much better player than he would have been had he stayed here and played 10 games against St John's, St George's and Falcon.
Unfortunately they are way ahead.

A Zimbabwe U13, U26, U19 cricketer owes his success to “Then there was the coach at Eastbourne who clearly helped him immensely as well”. It’s amazing how you have to deny reality just to forward British supremacy!!!You will say anything to elevate British cricket, facts be dammed. I therefore conclude that you are a deluded, brainwashed Anglophile zealot. Go and support your England, they need all the support they can get. It’s pointless debating things with you. Incidentally you’re the only person on this forum who believes this nonsense and that says a lot

Your intense dislike of all things British is amusing. I'm not a fan either, and I've mentioned that many times, but somehow that's proving to be difficult for you to digest.
I'm suspecting a denied visa has made you a candidate for a sleeper cell. and County was the trigger code.

If I start making comparisons between our system and South Africa's who have "poached" way more of our talented kids than SA has, will you brand me as an ANC Zealot? I'm guessing a Boer would be more convenient for your narrative. They're actually a good example and i should have gone down this route to tone down the xenophobic hydrophobia- when we were part of their Currie Cups we competed as a nation against their provinces and barring a couple of outstanding years we generally got beaten. That gap has also widened considerably and their cricket is in decline. I'd say their provincial/franchise cricket is probably on a par with the mid range counties. I don't know really, never gave that much thought until now, I guess much would depend on home advantage.

[TapsC2]

If we definitely want both Raza and Burl in the team, may I suggest that instead of dropping either Jongwe/Masakadza, we might be better off leaving Shumba out? I just feel 7 and 8 are too low for Raza/Burl, but 6 and 7 not so bad.

This feels like his weakest format and he isn't in outstanding form. It's harsh on him though. Unless he goes and gets a big score today.

Either way it's good that we have so many options in the lower-middle order and we are having this debate. If we had as many options at the top order as well then we'd be in a good position.

This makes more sense. Even as much as I hate to say it Wes. Who is in form should play. We need some back up on the bench anyway. They are young, it won't be the end of the world for them.

Wellington seems to be ready finally. I trust him more with the bat than Jongwe right now.

[lobsang]

Not necessarily. I'd have one of them. I'm just not sure we ever need both of Raza and Burl in the same team, especially if they are going to bat at low as 7 and 8? Seems like a luxury, having both.

I don't think Jongwe or Wellington have done anything to lose their places yet. And I think we all know the selectors will pick them both as well, rightly or wrongly.

You and i both know how fragile Zim openers for last 15 plus years, the openers have been, for Zimbabwe, like a walking wickets for the oppositions. Batting deep is the only option for Zimbabwe to have any chance to beat Sri Lanka coz you know it has always been like 15-2 or 35-3 for Zimbabwe after first 7 to 9 overs.

You are right tbf. But the answer is that the batsmen need to be better and perform better. If we are relying on number 8's and 9's to win us matches then we won't win many matches, ever.

Right but that is what Zimbabwe have at disposal. Definitely if there are four very good bowlers who could deliver matching winning spells then they can make room for all the four bowlers but the only true match-winner in the bowling department
Zimbabwe have is Muzarabani.

[CholeZimbo]

Kaitano
Chakabva
Ervine
Wes
Williams
Shumba
Raza
Burl
Jongwe
Blessing
Ngarava

We have basically lost 2 batsmen with BT and Myers gone. This has really affected our bench strength. Can't think of any reserve batsmen who I have faith in

Can't drop Wellington buddy