Countdown to Test cricket: Opening the batting (tiebreaker)

[bayhaus]

Those voting against Masakadza I would be interested to know whether he maintains a position in the team or by being axed at one he is axed from the team as well.

[hhm]

Those voting against Masakadza I would be interested to know whether he maintains a position in the team or by being axed at one he is axed from the team as well.

Without fail, he has to be in the XI somewhere in the top four - 3 in my opinion. However your 'concern' might just apply to Duffin. If he's not selected to open then he might as well miss out alltogether. His role is to see off the new ball and avert an early collapse while ensuring there's something acceptable on the scoreboard (I can't think of anyone better at this in our domestic cricket). There are better options for positions lower in the order - Williams, Craig, Taibu, Vusi, Ewing & Waller. So if he's overlooked as an opener then he shouldn't be there, I would even go for Matsi in that case!

Anyway, it looks like the ZCF is going for 1Talyor, 2Hamilton & 3Williams. I'm not complaining too much, but I'm certainly not that confident either. With the makeup of the top 3 looking as it is, the order of the rest of the middle order is not that much relevant to me. I hope we move on to the seamers before we revert to the middle order. I'm anxious to hear what you guys have to say. I'm quite confident the coaching department has Mpofu in there already - and I'm ok with that. That leaves Rainsford, Nicholson, Shingi, Meth, Chatara, Njabulo Ncube, Mupariwa, Panyangara & Jarvis (if he ever recovers). I'm going for Rainsford, and Meth as the 3rd seamer/allrounder (ahead of Chigumbura). He seems durable and disciplined enough for Test cricket. Except my options will be short of pace.

[Boundary]

Those voting against Masakadza I would be interested to know whether he maintains a position in the team or by being axed at one he is axed from the team as well.

Without fail, he has to be in the XI somewhere in the top four - 3 in my opinion. However your 'concern' might just apply to Duffin. If he's not selected to open then he might as well miss out alltogether. His role is to see off the new ball and avert an early collapse while ensuring there's something acceptable on the scoreboard (I can't think of anyone better at this in our domestic cricket). There are better options for positions lower in the order - Williams, Craig, Taibu, Vusi, Ewing & Waller. So if he's overlooked as an opener then he shouldn't be there, I would even go for Matsi in that case!

You've made a great case for Duffin hhm. I think brm should re-open the vote for the number 3 position. If done sequentially I think the team will evolve more naturally over the coming weeks.

[bayhaus]

From what I remember of Duffin he certainly seemed solid at one and I would warm up to the idea of Ham at 3, and Duffin opening, and then Ham opens with Taylor in the ODI's, for me Sean does not command a presence at number three.

[sloandog]

I think brm should re-open the vote for the number 3 position.

Why ? Just because you don't want him there...?
Listen everyone, it is presence at the crease...or runs that win you games >? Yh, runs!
I'm sick to death of hearing how 'weak' sean williams is, get a grip of what your saying, the lads possibly the best left handed batter in the country.

In terms of our pace bpwling, I'd go for Shingrai Mazakadza, Keegan Meth and Kyle Jarvis...pace, control, pace

[bayhaus]

I'm sick to death of hearing how 'weak' sean williams is, get a grip of what your saying,

That would be me I guess. Relax. Thats just my opinion. Unfortunately Seans weakness is his undoing. I think he can come further down the order somewhere.

[hhm]

I think brm should re-open the vote for the number 3 position.

Why ? Just because you don't want him there...?
Listen everyone, it is presence at the crease...or runs that win you games >? Yh, runs!
I'm sick to death of hearing how 'weak' sean williams is, get a grip of what your saying, the lads possibly the best left handed batter in the country.

In terms of our pace bpwling, I'd go for Shingrai Mazakadza, Keegan Meth and Kyle Jarvis...pace, control, pace

Williams is a classy player, and I don't think anyone would/should complain too much if he came in at first drop. However, one's reasoning should be sound when you make a call on this matter. A player selected to come in at three is expected to be comfortable facing the new ball and is also considered equally capable as an opener, which is what you effectively become if your openers are constantly knocked off early. And there's evry likelihood of that happening to us more often than not. On that basis Taylor, Duffin, Hamilton & Vusi(except he's sometimes vulnerable in the first few balls) have the proven experience and necessary qualities of being an opener, and hence fitting #3s (except Duffin of course - I suspect he's only ever known how to open). Williams doesn't, and nothing about him says he has the potential to open or see off the new ball! To date I don't remember seeing him have sustained exposure anywhere in the top 3, and I can guarantee you that even he would personally object to being selected to play there. He's not gritty and doesn't have the ability to adapt or grind out results (even Craig edges him out that respect). Everything about Sean says middle order batsmen. Period. In fact until I joined this forum, I had never heard or imagined I would hear his name being considered for the top 3. Having said that he is young, has the necessary class and with the appropriate effort he can deliver, hopefully better than the doomed-from-the-start Coventry/Regis experiment. Early on in his career, most considered Sean the best batting talent we had post the 'madness period', and I wouldn't want to disagree. I can picture him & Vusi batting together in the latter overs. When they play themselves in, I can't think of more fluid batters in our potential lineup and that's what we should look forward to, not him trying to stave off the new ball with the Steyns, Johnsons, Zaheers, Broads, Guls & Southees of this world coming at him in full flow!

On the bowling note, it's only logical to accept that it's too late for Kyle to make an apperance now. However excited we all are about his pace and potential, it remains just that - potential! Let him have a full season of First Class cricket. If his body holds up he can have a run. If not he can be banished to ODIs & T20s. Nicholson is close but still has some work to do. Chatara had an exceptional season of FC cricket, but let him back it up with another stellar season. Meanwhile he can have a run in the ODIs. Shingi looks durable, but is too raw, inexperienced and doesn't appear smart enough as a bowler - so not Test cricket quality. You could have said the same about Mpofu when he first appeared but they worked very hard on him and the results are there for all to see. Let's hope the same works for Shingi. As for Mupariwa, when given the chance he hardly ever disappointed, probably the only Zim bowler I would trust to bowl a dot bal if my life depended on it, except he's not much of a wicket taker. This was pretty much Panyangara's first season back, and in all honesty, he didn't disappoint. He is intelligent and has better class & experience than Chatara, Shingi, Nicholson & Jarvis. He will come good and his disappointing show at the WC will motivate him even more. I'm confident his records will reflect this in the next Logan Cup season. So I would have to say he'll be next in line. Even John Ward acknowleged that he has a workhorse attitude (which is suitable for Test cricket), even though he did say the more on form Chatara shoud have gone to the WC ahead of him. Meth is intelligent, has been delivering in recent years and been in the picture for a long time now (just unfortunate like Mutizwa). He also has the added advantage of being a better batsmen so that's enough to get him in - for first change at least. By and large we have invested more in Mpofu and Rainsford. Over recent years they have been in the frame, continue to deliver in FC and not disappointed much in ODIs. They worked hard for it and have proven their consistency. They are the seniors and definitely deserve the nod. No one should deprive them of that opportunity to be our opening pair.

My dear friends Test cricket is not a joke. Initially, where we can, we should go for suitable Test material options who are tried and tested. These guys who were said to be 'pathetic school kids' then are more mature now. We should pick guys who have been on tour and in the international circuit long enough. Players who can do what's necessary to spend a long time out in the middle and bowl long tight spells when wickets are not falling. Guys who are able to do what's necessary to force a draw and avoid folding within 2 or 3 days. And we shouldn't be shy to discard players who were never suited for Test cricket in the first place e.g Elton, Chamu & Coventry. Afterwards we can then gradually and carefully blood in the new/younger guys in place of those who wont be performing. But upfront, if need be, even the likes of Matsi should be in the frame, no matter how much some of us joke negatively about him he's good (in fact bar Taibu I can't think of many of our batsmen who are more stubborn and gritty than he is - our very own Collingwood - except he has more flashes of class, his cut shot can more than rival Sehwags!). Anyway the point is, this is the first time we'll be playing Tests after the sad and embarrassing period we subjected ourselves to following that exodus of players. We must avoid a repeat of that. Many people can't wait to see us fail, and feel we shouldn't be allowed back at all. If we carry on putting forward novices like Chatara, Shingi, Mawoyo & Regis we will once again be sorry, let alone damage their morale&future, much to the delight of these of these prophets of doom. Of that I can assure you!

[ZIMDOGGY]

Some very good points above by the last few posters.

yes Williams is possibly our best bat.
Yes he is weak both mentally and physically. Can't deny that either.
and great post all round Hhm ( except for the random matsi jizzfest)

[sloandog]

I'm sick to death of hearing how 'weak' sean williams is, get a grip of what your saying,

That would be me I guess. Relax. Thats just my opinion. Unfortunately Seans weakness is his undoing. I think he can come further down the order somewhere.

Just in general mate.
I find it frustrating that's all how people blame williams for getting injured so much, automatically thinking that he's not up to the mark.
I was injured for the best part of last seasn with a back injury, and a lot of people were taking the mick, saying how injury prone i was, but i recovered and i performed with both bat and ball. Injurys are package and parcel with any sport, i just want people to undertand that.
Good post by Jhunter, very good.
Though I don't agree about Rainsford being in. His pace is down and he's lost that swing he used to have.
Maybe Jarvis wouldn't be a great choice actually, but Nicholson should be in sooner rather than later, i really liked what i saw in South Africa, despite the fact that he went for runs. he bowled 87Mph, so the signs are good

[bayhaus]

Nice read hhm!

He's not gritty and doesn't have the ability to adapt or grind out results (even Craig edges him out that respect). Everything about Sean says middle order batsmen.

This is what I meant by my comment that Williams "a presence at number three."

I can picture him & Vusi batting together in the latter overs. When they play themselves in, I can't think of more fluid batters in our potential lineup and that's what we should look forward to

Vusi certainly thats one dude I enjoy watching when he gets going.

As for Mupariwa, when given the chance he hardly ever disappointed, probably the only Zim bowler I would trust to bowl a dot bal if my life depended on it, except he's not much of a wicket taker .

Mpariwa seemed to have lost form big time but in ODI he was the fastest to 50 wickets in the whole history of Zimbabwe cricket!

Matsi - Except he has more flashes of class, his cut shot can more than rival Sehwags!)

Yeah I used to love see matsi play his cuts! But it was also his downfall cos the GOOD bowlers set him up, kept giving him until he was caught!

This was pretty much Panyangara's first season back, and in all honesty, he didn't disappoint. He is intelligent and has better class & experience than Chatara, Shingi, Nicholson & Jarvis. He will come good and his disappointing show at the WC will motivate him even more. I'm confident his records will reflect this in the next Logan Cup season. So I would have to say he'll be next in line. Even John Ward acknowleged that he has a workhorse attitude (which is suitable for Test cricket)

Panyangara bowled well against NZ and the even admitted that they plan was to see him off and take on the other bowlers. He bowled way more overs than everyone though he didnt take many wickets, he had a good economy.